6 Cylinder Diesel For a D9

[hintzconst]

So I've been watching these forums for the last month and decided that now is as good a time as any to start my project. I am building a diesel powered D9 in 1:5 scale. Since there aren't any multi cylinder engines that I could find I am designing a model sized diesel engine. I'm going to build 3 variations to see which one works best. One will be a 200 cc 6 cylinder, one will be a 200 cc turbocharged, and a 135 cc 4 cylinder. Below is the beginings of the cad prototyping process, for the 6 cylinders' The 6 cylinder engines will be 3" wide x 6" tall x 10.5" long and the 4 cylinder will be the same height and width but 2 cylinders shorter so about 7" long. These will also be water cooled and have a pressure oil system much like their full size counterparts. I figure at the rate I'm going right now it'll be about a month before I get to make any chips, but if I hoping that I can address most of the blatent misfortunes that can befall the engine in model space. When I finally actually get it built I'm thinking spectaular is the proper word, whether everything is good and it fires up and runs smooth or bad and the little connecting rods come flying out of the side of the block it'll be spectacular to watch. So as I make progress I'll keep everyone posted.

http://i1077.photobucket.com/albums/w463/hintzconst/36b7d567.jpg

[Espeefan]

If you can pull this off, it will be incredible! A 1:5 scale turbocharged diesel? Good grief man, that's the stuff legends are made of. Quite the project, you've got there. Good luck, and keep us posted. Not many internal combustion diesel engines exist for this hobby. Think this could be a first!

[rc_farmer]

U are taking on a project and a half........i am definitely going to keep an eye on this one!

[pigeonfarmboy]

Crazyness. Can't wait to see results. Make sure to take video of testing please!

[hintzconst]

So far my biggest design road block has been the injection system, I'm afraid that if I use anything less than 304/316L stainless or maybe inconel 625 for the injector needles they won't operate properly or will bend from the pressure of the fuel, I'm using mechanical fuel injection, just to clarify. Anyone have any ideas, the needles need to be .0625 dia and about .375" long to work properly. Thanks for the comments, I picked this because could only find 1 diesel engine on youtube and that was built as a stationary engine, it didn't look like it would work in an r/c so I figured that be perfect.

[Madda]

Great to see high technology builds here!

What machines are you going to use for this build?
Are you an automotive engineer by trade?

[td9clyde]

cool project but wouldn't a 1/4 scale be a lil easyer? and or maybe a detroit 671 ? 2 stroke diesel?

[steamer]

I've seen a 12 cylinder engine with fuel injection. The fellow used hypo needles and I think they're stainless for the injectors. Engine ran fine and the hypo needles stood up to the heat in the engine. I know the fellow has passed away, but I'll see if I can find a picture.
Rob

[mog]

good luck when you get all the hard stuff figger out mabey the rest can falllow lol. there is a little video to keep you going http://youtu.be/E4-fOw6vr34 i think this would look just great in a cat.

[hintzconst]

@MADDA

I'm actually a general contractor by trade, I used to do cnc prototyping in a shop that only worked with "exotic" metals. The closest we came to mild or carbon steel was 304 Stainless. Most projects were 304/ 316L, Titanium, Monel, Inconel, Hastoloy, ect. If everything works out as currently planned I will be building this with a 4 axis VMC and slant bed CNC lathe, that I am planning on adding to my metal shop, if not I'll be using my 10x50 bridgeport clone and southbend 10Lx36 lathe so i'm really hoping the pieces all fall into place properly.

@TD9CLYDE

1/4 scale would be easier but in the grand scheme of things the weight of it was what decided that it would be 1/5. The is about 3500 lbs different between 1/5 and 1/4 for the whole build. I've never been a fan of the 2 stroke diesels, I'm sure they're great but not my cup of tea. Since most of my enjoyment comes from the design and build I'm not looking for the easy way but the best functioning piece I can make.

@STEAMER

I'm really leaning toward the stainless mostly because I know the joys of machining inconel, not to mention the overall cost of it.

@MOG

This video is actually my inspration for this build. In its current form I didn't believe that it looked ready for use in an r/c so I decided to build one that could be used in any r/c that it could fit in. My eventual goal is to design and build a 1/12-1/14 scale diesel engine but I wanted to start with a bigger one so I can figure everything out.

[9W Monighan]

There's a guy I met from the Cabin Fever Expo that's been building a D353 for quite some time. He builds a small amount yearly and when I talked with him last January, He was working on getting the gear train to time correctly for the scale he's working to.
I wonder if such a small engine would even put out enough exhaust to run such a tiny turbocharger not to mention getting the injection pump and injectors to work.

[Diesel Demond]

All i can say is 'WOW' cant waite to see this

[Jared]

Wow, this should be cool! D353s are the best sounding engine ever. My cousin has a fishing boat with one in it and it sounds awesome. What rpms will it be turning?
I know the guys over at http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/ would love to see what you got going and are a wealth of information as well.

[mazdaparts]

Didn't some of the first rc engines run on diesel? I don't think they were what you are envisioning though. I can't wait to see how this plays out.

[hintzconst]

@ Jared
The engine should idle between 500-650 rpm, it should produce about 15 hp at 25-2800 rpm and would be governed to 3200 with an electronic fuel shutoff at 4000 rpm just in case it runs away.

@ Mazdaparts
Some of the first r/c engines were diesel engines but not in that form that we think of diesel engines. They could not run on diesel fuel, they were compression engines that ran on a cocktail of low flashpoint fuels.

Well today I've started ordering my material. Going to go pick it up tomorrow at McMaster Carr will call. Going to start with a 6" x 12" piece of soild cast iron and whittle it down to the block. It's amazing how few suppliers carry cast iron bar. The block design is finished and I'm getting antsy to have something to show for the design time besides a pretty picture.

[doodlebug]

Have you heard of Dura Bar? http://www.dura-bar.com/

Cheer's, Neil.

[hintzconst]

I actually had priced out durabar but all the suppliers I contacted were $15-$20 more per foot than McMaster Carr which really surprised me. I also checked into having the block cast and if I was making 10,000 of them it would make sense but all the upfront costs for a one off was almost laughable. If in the future I get in a position to make lots of these I'll be able buy it from the suppliers in bulk which would make it quite a bit cheaper.

[Jared]

Will the bore and stroke be the same as a D353? They are 6.25"x8" and redlined about 1200-1225 rpm which is my favorite thing about them. Much more enjoyable to live with on a boat rumbling at 800 rpm for long periods of time compared to a Jimmy whining at 1500. I know you're not building a D353 but in case anyone's interested here's a spec sheet for the marine version: http://marine.cat.com/cda/files/1014947/7/Spec%20Sheet%20-%20Cat%20D353%20Propulsion.pdf?mode

[hintzconst]

I'm actually loosely basing this on the Cat C18 powerplant. The bore and stroke work out to 1.25" x 1.75".

Picked up the cast iron this morning and decided to get started roughing out the shape of the block.

http://i1077.photobucket.com/albums/w463/hintzconst/Model%206%20cyl%20diesel%20engine/906ade72.jpg
This is 5 inch for the head, connecting rods, & injector pumphousing

http://i1077.photobucket.com/albums/w463/hintzconst/Model%206%20cyl%20diesel%20engine/b36ffbc0.jpg

http://i1077.photobucket.com/albums/w463/hintzconst/Model%206%20cyl%20diesel%20engine/d09aea50.jpg
And this is where the drawbar broke ending the progress for the day

[kerst]

Wow! This going to be interesting!

kerst

[tc1cat]

A working diesel in 1/5th scale:eek: You really are ambitious!! In all of the years that I have been going to the N.A.M.E.S. show in the Detroit area, I have never seen a miniature working diesel. The N.A.M.E.S. show is a model engineering show for working miniatures of all sorts of engines. I am going to be watching this build very closely.

Your drawbar broke! Without knowing how much of a cut you were taking but a Bridgeport mill is not going to handle much of a cut with a 1" or larger end mill for very long unless you are using a roughing end mill.

[Jared]

Here's a 4-cylinder.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4-fOw6vr34

[Speedy]

will be following closely :D

[hintzconst]

Its been too hot the last couple days to get into the shop and get anything done but sweat. I got the mill fixed and was able to finish roughing out the stock so that I can rough out the block this week. I did, however, get the crankshaft laid out so that is all designed as well as the connecting rods and pistons. So hopefully I'll have a long block in about 2 weeks. The head and overhead cam I still have lots of work to do, but everything is getting easier as we go. One thing I need to figure out is how to evenly heat up since I don't have anything that gets that hot. I was thinking of looking for pottery kilns on craigslist.

@ TC1CAT

As I had mentioned earlier in the thread the reason I wanted to build a fully functioning scale diesel engine was because I had only found 1 on the internet that actually worked, and that was a four cylinder, naturally aspirated.

As for the breaking of the drawbar, one of my employees had stripped 1/2" of the 3/4" of thread that goes into the collet and because I was just straight roughing I was pushing the mill pretty hard. I was taking aprox. .500 x .250 cuts with a 3/4" solid carbide endmill at aprox. 10 ipm feedrate in solid cast iron. The chips were coming right off but the drawbar being already weakened couldn't keep up and the rest of the threads stripped off leaving the collet to spin and bounce.

[tracksntreadslou]

Very cool build ..Have you seen this one?..Another 4 cyclinder and not sure what its running on.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63GqeB_UpH8&list=FLrZb-NTve7fdAH_EtyERHzA&index=61&feature=plpp_video

[dabears]

Very cool build ..Have you seen this one?..Another 4 cyclinder and not sure what its running on.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63GqeB_UpH8&list=FLrZb-NTve7fdAH_EtyERHzA&index=61&feature=plpp_video

Now that one is cool!!