Dozer vs Trackloaders

[Claus]

44lbs would be perfect lowboy load! How come nobody produces a bulldozer? Stahl is the only one I know of, we have track loaders and hoes seem to be more and more all the time so I know it's not an issue with tracks. Would love to see a D8R or something in kit form.

[cdm]

i think its because the track loaders get all you need to get done, well done.

hoes:

vario machine - 1 variant, like it or hate it
wedico - 1 variant with some attachments
premacon - have it your way
damitz - we might sell you one, eventually.
no name rc4 machine - lots of power, but thats about it. metal tracks tho
stahl - do we still sell these?

loaders

wedico
fumotec
premacon
scale art

trucks

bell 35, bell 50, cat model number something

trailers
just about any way you want them

What am i missing above? I know i am missing some.

We don't have cranes, scrapers would be really nice, graders are missing, mining trucks are none to be found, compactors would be useful,

and that thing:

http://www.qatcom.com/uploads/listing/advert/gulf%20construction%20machinery%20em1.jpg

looks to be some sort of a side scraping/boring machine

[Claus]

That is a trencher for putting in cable, field tile or pipe. Like a chainsaw on tracks.

[Espeefan]

i think its because the track loaders get all you need to get done, well done.

I don't know about that. Track loaders and wheel loaders both have their advantages and disadvantages. I wouldn't say one or the other is an 'end all be all machine'. Wheel loaders seem to have higher reach, track loaders better maneuverability in tight spaces. Different machines for different applications. Even the same machines, in different sizes, hold advantages over each other in the right circumstances.

[Claus]

Yes, if that were true you would not see dozers on construction sites. Dozers out number track loaders by far. Usually track loaders are used when traction or compaction is a problem with a wheel loader.

[cdm]

in a small scale dozers are useless guys. they lack the one thing that makes them worth it in real size: weight and power.

a 20lbs dozer won't even scrape, and when you are talking about model earth (either the premade fake one or sifted sand) the trackloaders serve as both. i guess people are not willing to pay for it when the machines overlap almost identically in the 20lbs range.

[Espeefan]

Chris, what kind of RC dozer do you have?

[RCLogger]

in a small scale dozers are useless guys. they lack the one thing that makes them worth it in real size: weight and power.

a 20lbs dozer won't even scrape, and when you are talking about model earth (either the premade fake one or sifted sand) the trackloaders serve as both. i guess people are not willing to pay for it when the machines overlap almost identically in the 20lbs range.

My CAT dozer moves a lot of dirt in a short time, company's may not see a market for them because it is not the most entertainment pushing dirt.

My CAT works great, the swing blade is 13 by 7 inches in size. The D8R carrier blade is pushing in wet sand, very heavy material.. The CAT D8N is in topsoil, not packed, but in any case I think they work very well in scale.
Greg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elBpaKt76ys&list=UUcJMILW4-PhxrdmLzqdYL-Q&index=22

[RCLogger]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9jJrjuARbw&list=UUcJMILW4-PhxrdmLzqdYL-Q&index=20

[cdm]

Chris, what kind of RC dozer do you have?

none for the reasons i listed above.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9jJrjuARbw&list=UUcJMILW4-PhxrdmLzqdYL-Q&index=20

can be done with a trackloader :confused:

i think this is a pointless argument. scale that small, things overlap.

[ihbuilder]

Um , Chris you really need to watch some more youtube vids . I was born in the seat of a dozer (so to speak). I'll guarantee you in a pushing situation the Dozer will out doo a loader by a long sea mile .

[Dieselholic]

I'm a full time operator, and I would say those things push pretty darn well.

[Lil Giants]

you can carry on with your apples & oranges argument here. ;)

[Bigrigger]

you can carry on with your apples & oranges argument here. ;)

Here I was going: "How could a request like this turn into a argument thread?"

Oh the wonders of the Internet!:rolleyes::D

[Brel]

there is no contest between the two as they are designed to do different jobs

[Rvjimd]

Could someone compare a wheel and track loader just a bit? I'm not sure i understand the benefit of the track loader vs the slower travel speed and reduced road use. I sort of understand the weight and power at scale issue and am most I interested in scale information and performance. Sorry if this is too much of a thread hijack.

Jim

[tc1cat]

Patience grasshoppers!! There is a sort of generic D8 in the design/ fabricating stages being worked on here in the States. Prototypes are close:D

[doodlebug]

Could someone compare a wheel and track loader just a bit? I'm not sure i understand the benefit of the track loader vs the slower travel speed and reduced road use. I sort of understand the weight and power at scale issue and am most I interested in scale information and performance. Sorry if this is too much of a thread hijack.

Jim

Wheel loader's work best on hard surfaces, a tracked machine will float better in wet soft condition's, track's can hold up better when the rock's are sharp. A tracked machine will climb a steeper ramp than a wheel loader, in tight quarter's, a tracked machine will maneuver in a tighter space.
Now to stir the pot, I have seen basement's dug with Cat 955's, D5's, and various Hanomag wheel loader's, all 3 have pretty much been replaced with excavator's for basement dig's. My how thing's have changed since the early 70's
Yes they all have there place, and how many rear engine dozers have been built since Eimco got out of building construction machine's http://talk.newagtalk.com/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=180599&mid=1310756
I have operated one of these.
And then there is the German hybrid machine Frutiger scrape dozer, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWTKWDfmUkI
Hope I haven't confused you too much, and there are alway's exception's or abuse to any earthmoving rule of thumb!!!!!!
Cheer's, Neil.:eek::eek::eek:

[Espeefan]

I'd have to guess a track loader would have better pile 'dig in' then a wheel loader, just because of the traction, but here again, it would probably depend a lot on the weight of the machines, and the surface they are running on.

Those scrapedozers are interesting! Never knew anything like that existed!

[ihbuilder]

A track type loader has better traction then a rubber tires loader . Therefore , it has better digging capabilities in virgin or compacted soils . As said above , a track loader is meant for softer footing (to a point , they will still sink like lead in muck :rolleyes:) whereas , a rubber tired serves will on hard surfaces i.e, quarries , infrastructure work /repair . Now a dozer is best at pushing and grading whereas , a loader loads ( as my dad would say "best at fetch and carry " :p )

Oh Neil who dug basements with a loader ???? :eek::eek::eek::confused::confused::p need a hole in the ground dig with a shovel right :rolleyes::p

[doodlebug]

Hey Steve, I have a friend that used 3 different Hanomag loader's, and he roaded it all over the county! my neighbor uses his John Deere 544's to dig and tag team with the excavator. From a fuel standpoint, a hoe will
Pull it out cheaper than a loader! Thanks for your explanation !
Cheers, Neil.

[RCP57]

I would say that in the model world a track loader is an OK compromise. My 955 with it's 4 in 1 bucket, technically has a blade but without being able to change the angle it is not all that useful. It is very similar in power, size and weight when compared to Greg's D8(955 1/10- D8 1/14 scale) but Greg's machine would have the job done and he could be building another model by the time I was halfway. As a loader it is slower and makes way more of a mess than Lou's 966. It is a bit of a jack of all trades, master of **** all type machine though which I think makes it appealing. At the end of the day though I built mine because my Dad has a 1:1 955K and I wanted a model of it. Arguing about what is better is kind of stupid. All of us wish that we had every piece of equipment out there and eventually if we live long enough to build or buy it we will!

Sorry was I just rambling:confused:

[sparkycuda]

Track loaders were very popular up to about 1990, then excavators began to dominate. Not confirmed yet, but I've heard CAT will be dropping track loaders in the near future. Komatsu dropped them about 8 years ago (at least in North America and Europe). As the construction market changes and shrinks, fewer models will be available from everyone. Generally, excavators are more versatile than track loaders, so the loaders will gradually fade. Same thing has happened with big dozers. In the 1980's Komatsu had over 300 large dozers running in Kentucky alone. Today, only about 20 large dozers are sold in the state - all brands - each year. No telling what new machines may appear over the next 20 years, but they will be high tech!

Ken

[doodlebug]

A track type loader has better traction then a rubber tires loader . Therefore , it has better digging capabilities in virgin or compacted soils . As said above , a track loader is meant for softer footing (to a point , they will still sink like lead in muck :rolleyes:) whereas , a rubber tired serves will on hard surfaces i.e, quarries , infrastructure work /repair . Now a dozer is best at pushing and grading whereas , a loader loads ( as my dad would say "best at fetch and carry " :p )

Oh Neil who dug basements with a loader ???? :eek::eek::eek::confused::confused::p need a hole in the ground dig with a shovel right :rolleyes::p

I just remembered 3 more contractor's that dug basement's with there loader's, One of them had a heel cutting edge on the back of his loader bucket for grading. Now both of my skidsteer bucket's have heel edges too!
Cheer's, Neil.

[woodhog]

I had a 544 j and a 544 k both had 28L26 skidded tires on them and they both would dig like crazy and had floatation. I could out dig my dads 963 track loader.