Vintage cable end dump trailers?

[Espeefan]

As an alternative to hydraulic hoist end dump trailers, I've been scouring the internet for information on the old cable end dump trailers. They were trailers from the '50s and earlier that were dumped using a winch on the back of the truck pulling it. The winch would pull the trailer axles forward, and they prettt much seem to ressemble a frameless end dump trailer, except for the obvious lacking of a lift cylinder. Problem is I can't find much info on these types of trailers. Is anyone familiar with these old trailers? I'm trying to find more photos and information, but it seems non-existent!

[JAMMER]

Hello Nathan I drove one of these trailers. What do you kneed to know? Ed

[Espeefan]

Hi Ed, everything! :D Really, I'm most interested in the cable routing, and how it is routed around the 5th wheel plate. I've seen some trucks dumping trailers, with the trailer turned 90 degrees to the truck. There must be some sort of pulley to allow the cable to make a 90 degree bend. Do you have any photos of cable dump trailers?

[JAMMER]

Nathan I tried to find some photos ,even tried a search but nothing the place that I drove for got bought out. The cable went under the fifth wheel to the trailer and if that cable broke it was quite an experience especially if the box was up. There was a guy on ebay selling Smith Miller trucks with a cable dumping the trailer with one of rc4wd winches. After the cable lift they went to a deal were the pto was on the tractor and the pump was on the trailer with a whip connecting the pto to the pump. You would jack-knife the tractor then connect the whip between the tractor the trailer. With these you had to be careful when you drove them that you did not jackknife or the whip would come unhooked. Hope this helped you if I find anything in my travels I will let you know and if I can help you with any more info don't be afraid to ask. Ed

[Espeefan]

Ed, thanks for the information. I have seen the Smith Miller cable dump trailers. I honestly didn't know such trailers even existed up to that point, but it got me thinking about trying to build or modify one of those trailers for RC use.

I can only imagine how wild it would be to have a cable fail, while lifting a loaded box! Ouch. On the 1:1 trailers, I assume they had multiple blocks and tackles, with pulleys to get a proper mechanical advantage? Did the cable connect to the trailer frame, or to the front axle of the trailer?

Yes, please keep me in mind, if you do find some photos of these old trailers. If I can get enough photos, perhaps I can actually try building one. It would be a neat alternative to running a hydraulic system. Plus the vintage factor is pretty cool.

[Lil Giants]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v150/protrker/Jan%2013/2ndset045.jpg

[Lil Giants]

Ed, do you recall the brand name of the cable dump trl you pulled? That would make the search for pics/info much easier... cable dump trailer is not showing anything, must be some other namesake for the application. :confused:

[modelman]

Espeefan-check with 9Wmonighan. He converted his Tournarocker into R/C
http://www.rctruckandconstruction.com/showthread.php?t=2973

[Finster]

Perhaps an avenue of research could be to ask the guys at HCEA (Historic Construction Equipment Assoc) http://www.hcea.net/ There is probably a member that has one and might help. Hope this helps.

[Finster]

Did a bit of looking around and found this:
http://www.shiawasseehistory.com/images/reliancegmc1912dump.jpg

Not sure how old school you want to go. :D

[doodlebug]

Did a bit of looking around and found this:
http://www.shiawasseehistory.com/images/reliancegmc1912dump.jpg

Not sure how old school you want to go. :D

That's a cool old truck!
Cheer's, Neil.

[Espeefan]

Thanks guys. I have been searching for a couple days and I have only found a few photos. I actually found some old brochures for these trailers, listed on E-Bay and some other E-Bay knock off. Havne't bought them, though they would be handy to help build a nice replica of such a trailer.

The only brand I have found so far is Hobbs Schonrock. There may have been others.

These photos aren't much to look at. Can't actually see the winch cable and pulleys all that well, but they did exist. I'd like to build one, if I could.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y127/Espeefan/Cabledump_zps5ab35375.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y127/Espeefan/Cabledumptrailer_zps9180cce7.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y127/Espeefan/Cabledump2_zps91457872.jpg

It's an easter egg hunt!

[Claus]

Nathan I'm not sure but I thought I seen somewhere Fruehauf had built one. Also look for Trailmobile, they were the same dump trailers.

[Espeefan]

Thanks Craig. Maybe I'll try some searches under that.

[Lil Giants]

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/2930653.pdf

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/2542795.pdf

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/2635919.pdf

[RCP57]

Nice find Joe!

[Espeefan]

Joe, awesome find! That will help me out a lot! Thanks for putting the effort into finding those prints. Especially the 5th wheel plate, with the pulley and cable routing. Now I might have a fighting chance of replicating one of these trailers.

[Lil Giants]

You're welcome Nathan, it peaked my curiosity too... I got a lucky click on some PDF's that appeared on one of many google links I looked at. :)

[Espeefan]

Well thank you Joe, and to everyone else who responded! Now I just need to find some photos of winches and how they mount them to the trucks!

[Lil Giants]

A wdc winch should be stout enough for something like this?

[ihbuilder]

I gotta go through my grandfathers stuff I bet the info is there :rolleyes:

HOLY crap :eek: Nate you just gave me an Idea for scrappy to use as a temporary dump mechanism till I make the cylinder for it :D.

[doodlebug]

Have you tried Hank's Truck site?
Cheer's,Neil.

[Lil Giants]

That was the 1st place I tried Neil and the search brought me nothing, as most of the pics are not individually named. :(

[BRICKNICK]

Wow that amazing, I've never seen that sort of old school dump trailer. Amazingly simple but kind of effective. That would be a really neat build to be pulled behind an old b model mack or a crazy old brockway/ autocar.

[Espeefan]

A wdc winch should be stout enough for something like this?

Maybe, Joe. I never really heard of anyone using one for anything besides the tow truck bodies. I would think even a weak winch could still dump a trailer. Make a couple loops with the cable. A block and tackle would double or triple the pull pretty easily.

I gotta go through my grandfathers stuff I bet the info is there :rolleyes:

HOLY crap :eek: Nate you just gave me an Idea for scrappy to use as a temporary dump mechanism till I make the cylinder for it :D.

Do some digging, and let me know! Scrappy would be cool as a cable dump.

Wow that amazing, I've never seen that sort of old school dump trailer. Amazingly simple but kind of effective. That would be a really neat build to be pulled behind an old b model mack or a crazy old brockway/ autocar.

I thought the same thing. A really great, and prototypical alternative to screw drives, and hydraulics! You read my thoughts exactly about a nice vintage truck trailer combo. Lets just say I'm working on it.

[Lil Giants]

Lets just say I'm working on it.

Perhaps you'll have your 1st running rc trk... ever? :p :D

[Espeefan]

Perhaps you'll have your 1st running rc trk... ever? :p :D

No kidding, right? I won't know what to do with a real, functional, driveable RC semi truck! :D

[TRUCKMAKER]

No kidding, right? I won't know what to do with a real, functional, driveable RC semi truck! :D

Nathan, the only way I see having a real, functional, drivable RC semi truck is finding some else to build a kit and hand it to us RTR. I can't even build a simple tamiya pole trailer without reworking and modifying the s##t out of it!
All seriousness aside this cable dump defiantly would be a fun build to tackle, I just hope hydraulics aren't outdated by the time it's done!:p:p:D

[Lil Giants]

It'll probably be 5yrs, maybe 4, that I attend the next St Louis meet... think you can get it done by then & I'll pick you up along the way? :D

[buzzy16]

These trailers look very nice, nice change compared to the regular dumps.

[Espeefan]

Nathan, the only way I see having a real, functional, drivable RC semi truck is finding some else to build a kit and hand it to us RTR. I can't even build a simple tamiya pole trailer without reworking and modifying the s##t out of it!
All seriousness aside this cable dump defiantly would be a fun build to tackle, I just hope hydraulics aren't outdated by the time it's done!:p:p:D

Tell me about it! But then again, who wants a cookie cutter rig anyway? 3/4 of the fun is building one and making it your own. I just......get a little carried away sometimes! :D

It'll probably be 5yrs, maybe 4, that I attend the next St Louis meet... think you can get it done by then & I'll pick you up along the way? :D

It'd be a little out of your way, Joe, to come pick me up, but okay! I should have something done by then. :D

[Claus]

So, Nathan, when are you going to drop the bomb on everyone?

[Espeefan]

When I'm done building it. :) Speaking of that, I should get off the forum. I'm not going to get it finished if I sit here all night!

[JAMMER]

Nathan I don't know if you realize this or not but when those trailers were around the tractor were single axles and those trailers weren't very long. To give you an idea of what I'm talking about the one I drove was a 20 foot trailer with a 260 Brockway with a 5 speed trans. You didn't have many super highways mostly what you would call back roads today. Ed

[Espeefan]

Nathan I don't know if you realize this or not but when those trailers were around the tractor were single axles and those trailers weren't very long. To give you an idea of what I'm talking about the one I drove was a 20 foot trailer with a 260 Brockway with a 5 speed trans. You didn't have many super highways mostly what you would call back roads today. Ed

Ed, I haven't found a lot of photos, other then what I posted here, but I did notice all the trucks were single axles. In the prints, at least some of the trailers are tandems. For the sake of 'play value', if I build anything, both the truck and trailer will be tadem axle, but I'm not sure how long the trailer will end up being. It would be nice if it could still take at least as much load as a straight frame dump truck. Thanks for the tip though! Back then, it would have been great to have thought about snapping some photos! Those old pieces of equipment have almost all disappeared today.

[doodlebug]

Dang it! I'm not home to search my library. I might have some pictures for you, just need more than a 34 hour restart to find them.
Cheers, Neil.

[Espeefan]

Anything you can find would be great, Neil. I'm not in a hurry for photos, just yet. I have a truck to finish first.

[BRICKNICK]

No , right? I won't know what to do with a real, functional, driveable RC semi truck! :D

LOL that makes two of us...my king runs, just needs tweaking ang a new controller. N the globe is a work in progress.

[doodlebug]

I'm out for another week, oh well pay the bills and look forward to summer.
I'm itching to order a couple of king haulers, so I can start an oil field truck.
Cheer's, Neil.